Re: The Anti-NarSak Thread **READ FIRST POST**

[Mustang]

NS always say to me that if naruto could choose his girlfriend he would  choose sakura over hinata ...
What is your opinion ?

I am moving this to the anti-NS thread, since this is something that belongs there, we are arguing an NS argument. of course NS would say something like that, Naruto isn't a forgetful person, he knows that Sakura loves Sasuke and he is also fully aware of Hinata's love for him, NS is still clinging to Naruto's now questionable crush on Sakura. with a comment like that from NS, it seems like it wants to force Naruto and Sakura together, since there has been zero romantic development between the 2.

plus I think Naruto is making that choice, since he is fully aware of Hinata's love for him, he is starting o show signs of wanting to be with Hinata over Sakura, NS forgets that Naruto wasn't in love with Sakura and if he was, where is the evidence to prove it? NS seems to make a nasty habit of making Naruto and Sakura look shallow, when neither of the two characters are romantically interested in one another.

Sakura is loyal to her feelings towards Sasuke, Naruto is fully aware of this and like a true friend, he wouldn't get in the way. Naruto could easily choose Ino or TenTen for that matter, NaruIno or NaruTen has received no romantic development, which is about as much as NaruSaku, and yet just like NS it could occur, but with NaruHina and it's development, Naruto could easily end with Hinata, since it was Hinata that is going to make her move, in fact when Hinata makes her move, I am 100% certain, Naruto would be really happy to have someone like Hinata at his side.

[Irielo]

NS always say to me that if naruto could choose his girlfriend he would  choose sakura over hinata ...
What is your opinion ?

This NS argument tries to subtly and viciously show that:

1- Naruto does not have any choice, that's why he has to be with Hinata. This is something stupid because if Naruto had absolutely no interest in Hinata, he would have ignored her. And that's not the case at all. That explains Hinata's resolve of chapter 573 and wish (633). If Naruto was not giving her this positive feeling, I doubt Hinata would have been so confident.

2- Sakura must fall for Naruto. NS is so convinced that in that case, Naruto would just forget about Hinata and open his arms to Sakura. NS forgets that Naruto did have the opportunity to choose Sakura when she made her false confession but he rejected her. Moreover, it just tries to force Sakura to forget about Sasuke and to love Naruto instead because now Naruto has become "a better choice", which is something completely shallow.

3- This aspect of "Naruto choosing" is even quite an insult for Sakura and Hinata as if they were some kind of objects... And wishing Sakura to fall in love with Naruto just to prove that the latter would have preferred to be with her shows how far NS wishful thinking goes...

[Bubbles]

NS always say to me that if naruto could choose his girlfriend he would  choose sakura over hinata ...
What is your opinion ?

My opinion is that it's a weak fail of an argument that can be used against it easily.

"If Sakura could choose her boyfriend, she would choose Sasuke over Naruto."

[Starlight]

NS say that we don't care about Naruto's feelings what's your opinion?

[Irielo]

NS say that we don't care about Naruto's feelings what's your opinion?

NS misunderstands Naruto's feelings and the way they were portrayed in the manga. Unfortunately NS relies a lot on some anime fillers, movies or fanfics which don't have anything to do with the manga canon material and when it uses the manga, it's only trying to use parallels or forced symbolism, ignoring to see what is the most important: the interactions between the characters. Why? Because Naruto and Sakura's interactions are not based on a romantic development whereas Naruto and Hinata's interactions already since Part 1 tend to give the feeling of romance.

[Mustang]

^^weak argument again, Naruto was never in love with Sakura, he only had a crush which never developed beyond that point, it is really NS that doesn't care about the characters feelings, all it wants is Sakura to drop her love for Sasuke and suddenly fall in love with Naruto. NS wants Naruto to suddenly fall in love with Sakura, especially since Naruto is fully aware of Sakura's love for Sasuke.

Naruto cares a lot about Sakura's feelings for Sasuke so much so he wouldn't dare get in the way of Saukra's happiness.

parallels, third person POVs, all proven insignificant, and now NS is reduced to nothing but comic relief even in the most inappropriate times and places.

It doesn't take into consideration that Naruto can be happy with any of the other females in the series, it doesn't have to be just Sakura, Naruto isn't completely head over heels in love with Sakura, if he was, then there wouldn't be this awesome development NaruHina has gotten in the last 240 chapters. Naruto is no longer a moron, nor is he some love sick child that only sees one girl.

there are other girls out there, you know Ino, TenTen, Hinata, one of which he seems to have shown more interest in, this is something NS will never accept, so it comes up with weak arguments, to try and belittle NaruHina and SasuSaku, but what it does without even knowing, is that it belittles Naruto and Sakura, it belittles NS. it tries to make it that Sakura is the only girl in the series, it tries to force romance between Naruto and Sakura, considering that there is no romance between the two.

[Zoey]

I don't get why people still support NS.I mean Hinata's 'destiny' was known from the very beginning:from the moment MK made her in love with Naruto.If he wouldn't have wanted Hinata to be with Naruto in the end then he wouldn't even create a character like her.I mean let's say Naruto randomly falls in love with Sakura and he ends up with her.This wouldn't be a positive message for the audience especially after what Hinata has done for him.It's like her actions for Naruto were useless and insignificant which is totally not true.Not to mention Sakura's feelings for Sasuke.Pairing Sakura and Naruto now it's like trying to pair the sun and moon together(sorry couldn't find a better comparison).Anyway I don't think she will end up with Naruto unless NS do a kind of magic which make MK change miraculously his mind xD .

[Bubbles]

NS say that we don't care about Naruto's feelings what's your opinion?

Besides it being utter bullcrap? I hate that "argument." If we do not want Naruto with Sakura, we do not care about Naruto, only Hinata and what she wants. First of all, I love Naruto, he's in my top 4 characters I care the most about in this manga. I want for Naruto what I truly believe would be good for him in the longrun.

NS thinks Naruto "wants" Sakura, and because he's main character, Naruto should get what he wants. I've never actually seen an argument to show why Naruto "wanting" Sakura means she's best suited with him or would be better for him than Hinata. All I see is 'main character gets whatever he wants.'

What really sickens me about this argument is that while it sits there, accusing NH of not caring about Naruto's feelings, it shows a blatant disregard for Sakura's. Her feelings are labeled as shallow, stupid or immature. NS refuses to take them seriously despite the clear emphasis that's put on her love for Sasuke.

But to NS, she's just "confused" or in love with the "idea" of Sasuke and she will only "grow up" if she wants Naruto in the end instead. It shits on her character enough to assume she will never grow until she decides to bang Naruto, but it also severely downplays Sakura's feelings while upplaying Naruto's in order to even use this argument.

Unlike Naruto, Sakura is actually in love with Sasuke and this love has persisted throughout the entire manga. NS uses the argument that Naruto is being "selfless" by accepting Sakura loving Sasuke, but it ignores that out of everyone, Kishi only has Naruto acknowledge and accept the person he likes, loves someone else.

Hinata has yet to be shown knowing or caring about Naruto's supposed feelings for Sakura, and despite Sakura realizing Hinata loved Naruto in the Pain arc, is still shown to love Sasuke without even a hint of Naruto on her mind as the guy she likes by 540.

I can't even understand that argument that NH does not care. Just what can NaruSaku provide one another that NaruHina can't and more?

Nothing. Unless it sticks with the "want" argument.  How about NS stops focusing on wants and focus on needs. Maybe Naruto wanted Sakura once upon a time, but she's not the kind of girl he needs in his life. Not romantically anyway. She's not patient enough and Naruto tends to get on her nerves. She's pretty bossy and yells at him which never really helps. Her comic relief slapstick routine doesn't hurt their relationship, but it doesn't help either, despite NS using the tsundere argument of "keeping Naruto in line" Naruto never learns from her temper tantrums.

He just does it again later. Sakura and Naruto are good friends, but they do not work relationship wise. To Naruto's loud, at times impatient and brash nature, he needs calm and collected, patient and understanding. Sakura will hit him and yell when upset, but that isn't what he needs in a partner.  

He needs someone who will be by his side, understand his feelings and react accordingly. Hinata is incredibly perceptive. She would not yell at him or anything loud, she'd be there cooling him down or making him feel better when he's down. NS uses Sakura "cheering" Naruto up during Sasuke arc in Part II, but Sai also helped. Each time Hinata helped, it was just her. Naruto only needed to hear her words of encouragement to rise again with confidence.

Naruto needs someone who has always believed in him, even at times when he didn't fully believe in himself. He needs someone who can give him the strength to stand when he's feeling down and out. He needs someone who will love him unconditionally, just because he's him, knowing he's not perfect, but finding greatness in him anyway. He needs someone who he doesn't feel the need to impress, because she's already impressed just by him being there as him.

Naruto has had to live all his life trying to rise up to get respect from people, yet while the rest of the village cheered in 450, Hinata only needed to smile, because she already knew how great he was.

As a NH lover of course I care about Hinata's feelings and I know him being with her will make her the happiest woman alive. But I do not ship for canon unless I see something there. Something that has the great potential to be beautiful. I ship Naruto with Hinata not because it's what I think he "wants", but because I know Hinata can make him the happiest man alive.

I believe she is a great fit for him and I have yet to see a legit argument against NH. It's always just about Hinata as a character or downplaying her feelings or saying Naruto will never love her. No actual arguments against NH and why it wouldn't be a good pairing. And that's because there aren't any. Because NH is a great pairing, whether or not it's ones cup of tea, there is nothing negative, therefore how is it bad for Naruto, or not caring about Naruto if one ships it?

[Mustang]

The only way for NS to become canon, is for this scenario to happen, (I told NS this and it got really angry at me for it)
Naruto needs to fall in love with Sakura, Sakura needs to drop her love for Sasuke and fall in love with Naruto and an entirely new series, none of which has happened to this day. especially a brand new series

the sad part is, it pairs Sasuke and Hinata with death or one another, ignoring the feelings of all four involved, as long as it gets what it wants then nothing else should matter, but, I guess that now with the story coming to a close in the next couple of years there is still some things to happen, I feel that Hinata's confession is one of those things to be answered, Kishi doesn't have to do it, but I feel that he will bring a nice end to that story.

[Irielo]

You did it again Bubbles!   :mood: Well done!  

[Mustang]

I will be honest, I like NaruSaku, but only on a friendship level, there is no romance and I think we all know that their friendship is built from another character, Sasuke helped Sakura understand Naruto a bit more than she did initially, there is nothing wrong with that, sure Sakura get's a little upset when Naruto says/does something stupid, but then again that is what NS has been reduced to as of late.

this not caring about a character's feelings is just showing me that it is willing to repeat an argument that was lost long ago, these parallels, just show desperation, the third person POV, has be overdone and proven wrong, the only POVs I rely on are from characters that have know Naruto and Hinata the longest and know that there is something going on between them, they are Kiba and Neji.

plus I think we also know that Sakura knows that Hinata loves Naruto, she is a friend to both of them, I don't think it is in Sakura's character to hurt Hinata, knowing that Hinata loves Naruto. Sakura is better than that, she is better than that to drop her feeling for Sasuke, maybe that is due to the fact that she is loyal to her feelings, she isn't that shallow to say "I am sorry Sasuke, you're a villain while Naruto is a hero, I have fallen for him instead," if Sakura went around and said something like that, what kind of message would that send. she hurts not only Sasuke but Hinata as well, knowing that the latter loves Naruto. plus I think we have all seen what happened when Sakura pulled something like that, Naruto rejected it, putting the final nail in the NS coffin.

there is a saying, behind every good man is a good woman. this works for both SasuSaku and NaruHina, maybe that is because both the girls understand the man they love and are the only ones that can provide that love towards their respective men, maybe that is one of the reasons why NH and SS are companion ships in the series.

[Bubbles]

You did it again Bubbles!   :mood: Well done!  

Why thank you Irielo!   

[Starlight]

Spoiler:

Well done Bubbles very good argument +rep for you

[racefan1992]

NS say that we don't care about Naruto's feelings what's your opinion?

The hypocracy of this statement is over 9000. NS says NH doesn't care? NS has never cared about Naruto or Sakura. Naruto has (too quote Y2J Chris Jericho) "never eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeever" said he 'wanted' Sakura (once again treating Sakura like an object) in the first place.

Here are the things Naruto has wanted:
1. Acknowledgement (got that)
2. Be Hokage (well on the way)
3. Save the world (same as above)
4. Maintain the bonds he has with the people he cares about (living or dead, done that)

There are 5 people in the series that have effect Naruto profoundly.
1. Mom
2. Dad
3. Kakashi-sensei (opened Narutos eyes on alot of things)
4. Saskue (first person he bonded too)
5. Hinata (once he found who Hinata was, second person he bonded too.)

Those 5 people have done alot for him, only thing Sakura has done is cause Naruto pain and misery. NS is still and will forever revolve around Saskue. One can't exist without the other. Saskue is pretty much the only reason Naruto and Sakura are even friends (and paired together) anyway. NS is all about Saskue, Saskue, Saskue. The only evidence NS has is Saskue and Saskue alone. NS has nothing else going for it. Even with Saskue as "evidence", Saskue seperates them.

Spoiler:

[Mustang]

I have often said this, much to the annoyance of NS, Naruto and Sakura are the biggest reasons why NS will not occur, first and foremost, the pairing is Sasuke centric, Sakura loves Sasuke and Naruto knows it, Sakura wanted Sasuke to come back and asked Naruto (albeit in a heartfelt plea to him) to bring Sasuke back, but what NS also needs to know is that Naruto wasn't only bringing Sasuke back for Sakura, he was doing it for himself, since he considered Sasuke a brother, that being cemented in 671.

plus if NS was to occur, Sasuke would never be in the picture and Hinata's love for Naruto would be ignored, well I would say the exact opposite has happened, Sasuke is still in the picture and Hinata is so confident that now she is resolving to walk with Naruto in the village while holding his hand.

I wouldn't say Sasuke separates them, he is the one that helped Naruto and Sakura become good friends, but he is the one that prevents any romantic development from occurring between the two.

I think you are missing a few people there Racer, Jiraiya was one of the character that taught him a shitload of stuff, Nagato, Iruka, there are a couple more, but I find that Sakura is an honourable mention at the number 11 spot, she did become his friend albeit after Sasuke lectured her.

[Irielo]

Something else: if Naruto wants to maintain his crush on Sakura, then, so be it, if his crush developed into something deeper, so be it. Naruto is the only one (and Kishimoto) to decide what to do with his life. No one, neither NS nor NH can determine what Naruto really wants.

However, 1)Naruto is someone who wants to move forward (chapter 647), 2)he is someone who does not want to lie to himself (given what he told to Sakura during the false confession) and 3)he is very sensible to others' feelings.

1) Naruto is no more a child. He has become mature enough to get over something (crush) which was leading to nowhere.

2) If Naruto was not interested in Hinata, he would have avoided such positive behaviors towards her (Ch 558-559, 614-616), knowing perfectly that the latter loves him.

3) If he did not care for others' feelings, then he would not have realized how much Sakura loves Sasuke and he would not have been thankful to Hinata. He would have simply played with her feelings, giving her false hopes.

[racefan1992]

@51-Mustang didn't mean too leave out Pervy Sage, Iruka and others. I was just going off the top of my head. Although i wouldn't include Sakura as a honorable mention, i'd just 'mention' her.

@Irielo touch on something, Naruto has always been perceptive of other people feelings (except for Hinata until she confessed). Naruto knows how Sakura feels toward Saskue and is no longer dense as ice towards Hinatas feelings.

[Irielo]

@Irielo touch on something, Naruto has always been perceptive of other people feelings (except for Hinata until she confessed). Naruto knows how Sakura feels toward Saskue and is no longer dense as ice towards Hinatas feelings.

When Naruto fought against Gaara, he told the latter how similar they were, that both suffered from loneliness and rejection from others. Naruto could understand Gaara perfectly because they had a lot of things in common. However, things changed for Naruto when he started to make bonds with people. Naruto had to hear what Iruka told Mizuki about him to realize that there was someone who respected and appreciated him because he had so far the impression that no one liked him until realizing that it was not the case.

To me, Naruto hearing Iruka and him hearing Hinata's confession are quite similar. The same way Naruto did not know that there were people like Iruka who did care for him, the same way he could not picture himself that a girl could love him the way he saw how Sakura loved/loves Sasuke. He had already started to bond with people on a friendship aspect but I don't think he realized/considered it as possibility to be loved by someone romantically.

And Hinata's "mission" was to bring this aspect of love (romantic) in his life, to let him know that there was someone loving him all this time.

[Strawberry]

NS always say to me that if naruto could choose his girlfriend he would  choose sakura over hinata ...
What is your opinion ?

I know you already had replies, but I wanted to say something because this argument is just invalid. Firstly, love is not about choice. You just simply fall for someone or you don't. If Naruto were to "choose" a girlfriend, he would choose the girl he likes.

But to address the argument, Naruto already rejected Sakura. He doesn't want a girl who doesn't want him, even if that girl is Sakura. One popular NarSak argument is that "Naruto should get what he wants", but that argument ignores the fact that Naruto doesn't want a girl who is in love with another. Naruto should be given more credit than that; he's a dumbass but he understands clearly what Sakura's feelings are.

I think Naruto could be falling for Hinata, so I will go ahead and say that if Naruto could "choose a girlfriend", he would choose a girl he likes and he knows is in love with him: Hinata.

[GreatKungLao]

Before:

Spoiler:

After:

Spoiler:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Before:

Spoiler:

After:

Spoiler:

Do I even need to comment about where is the progress and where is not after +600?

The whole manga of NS development, yeah, lol. I can "clearly" see how it "progressed".

Also, guys and girls, recently on Tumblr I've got an ask from NS, so if you want to see its destruction that leaves nothing to say back, here it is: http://greatkunglao.tumblr.com/post/83112742601/so-nhs-are-bragging-by-kiba-telling-naruto-not-to

I'm going to delete that post on Tumblr (I have my reasons), so enjoy untill it's too late. I'm not posting it right here in the post because a lot of rules will be broken then.

[Batokusanagi]

Spoiler:

Sorry, can't help you. I can only say that there's not much NS to be Anti about, it's like NH is relativity and NS is Newtonian mechanics. NS at this point hit rock bottom and now pulled out shovels to keep digging deeper and deeper.
I wrote a tumblr blog about the whole "full moon" nonsense (among other things) if anyone wants to check it out.

[Starlight]

Something I founded out on tumblr

Spoiler:

As you can see Hinata is facing towards the sun but...

Spoiler:

Notice how Sakura is facing away from the sun

I don't know about you but this tells me something

[racefan1992]

Spoiler:

Sorry, can't help you. I can only say that there's not much NS to be Anti about, it's like NH is relativity and NS is Newtonian mechanics. NS at this point hit rock bottom and now pulled out shovels to keep digging deeper and deeper.
I wrote a tumblr blog about the whole "full moon" nonsense (among other things) if anyone wants to check it out.

        

[Twin Steps]

Hinata's character [unfortunately] is mostly pairing centered. moreover, unlike with Ino's crush to Sai/Sasuke, Lee's crush to Sakura, or Naruto's crush to sakura, kishi KEPT Hinata's infatuation in part 2 and let it grow to the love we see now. If kishimoto didn't want NH, he would have had hinata drop her feelings, just like lee, ino, and naruto did. In fact, in the itachi pursuit arc, where team 7 & 8 go after itachi... we BARELY got any NH moments ... we only really got Hinata worrying about naruto and naruto warmly smiling at her. That was it. This would have been the PERFECT time to drop hinata's feelings, but no... right in the NEXT arc, we get her confessing her love.

[GreatKungLao]

Thanks to Bubbles and the philosophy of paralolz I came to this:

Madara have Inner Madara.
Sakura have Inner Sakura.

Also notice that SakuRA and MadaRA.

I found a new ship for canonz.

[Sponsored content]