Re: The Anti-NarSak Thread **READ FIRST POST**

[bricksquad88]

we already know how strong hinata feels for naruto but it is naruto's feelings for hinata that we must focus on

This x100.  . Hinata's feelings are fully established. Regardless of what one might ship, distorting the evidence won't bring your pairing any closer to being realized canonically. I see this happen quite often in the shipping community. A NS,NH,SS whatever will distort or over exaggerate the evidence displayed in the manga to suit their agenda. Look at the facts, nothing else.

[MichaelInsanity]

Regardless of what one might ship, distorting the evidence won't bring your pairing any closer to being realized canonically. I see this happen quite often in the shipping community. A NS,NH,SS whatever will distort or over exaggerate the evidence displayed in the manga to suit their agenda. Look at the facts, nothing else.

Though I don't see how that was distorting evidence, I was just pointing out a song, o_o I agree with you. I've noticed there are pairings who like to cherrypick and ignore the evidence that is already put on the table. This is quite... BOTHERSOME. For example

The hug Sakura gave to Naruto after the pain fight. Ok, now why is this NOT romantic? Simply because of this: Sakura's confession (fake confession). She was willing to ruin her friendship with Naruto, just to keep him from getting hurt. Why do I say this?

Well let's look at some more facts shall we? Sakura was willing to kill Sasuke to prevent him from getting deeper into the darkness, not because she wanted to protect Naruto, though that was a factor, but because she loves Sasuke so much, that she is willing to kill him so he doesn't turn evil.

By killing him, Naruto would never have been the same. Their friendship would have been done for. So you have to understand, she does not love Naruto in any other sense than a good friend. And even then, she is willing to take all of that away.

And that, is my evidence as to why Sakura does NOT love Naruto romantically.

[bricksquad88]

Regardless of what one might ship, distorting the evidence won't bring your pairing any closer to being realized canonically. I see this happen quite often in the shipping community. A NS,NH,SS whatever will distort or over exaggerate the evidence displayed in the manga to suit their agenda. Look at the facts, nothing else.

Though I don't see how that was distorting evidence, I was just pointing out a song, o_o I agree with you. I've noticed there are pairings who like to cherrypick and ignore the evidence that is already put on the table. This is quite... BOTHERSOME. For example

The hug Sakura gave to Naruto after the pain fight. Ok, now why is this NOT romantic? Simply because of this: Sakura's confession (fake confession). She was willing to ruin her friendship with Naruto, just to keep him from getting hurt. Why do I say this?

Well let's look at some more facts shall we? Sakura was willing to kill Sasuke to prevent him from getting deeper into the darkness, not because she wanted to protect Naruto, though that was a factor, but because she loves Sasuke so much, that she is willing to kill him so he doesn't turn evil.

By killing him, Naruto would never have been the same. Their friendship would have been done for. So you have to understand, she does not love Naruto in any other sense than a good friend. And even then, she is willing to take all of that away.

And that, is my evidence as to why Sakura does NOT love Naruto romantically.

I was just making a general statement lol.

[Mustang]

Sakura also understood, that even if she went to kill Sasuke it would have been a suicide mission, she was most likely going to die because of it, she didn't want Naruto to feel guilty, she knew her fate, to die while killing the one she loves, contrary to NS belief Sakura's feelings for Sasuke have never wavered, they never have and most likely never will. it refuses to see that the biggest reason why NS will not occur is the N and the S.

Naruto: for most likely showing feelings towards Hinata, for accepting the fact that Sakura will always love Sasuke and knowing that he will forever be friendzoned by Sakura. there is little to no evidence to suggest that he was ever in love with Sakure to begin with.

Sakura: She has friendzoned Naruto, there is no evidence to say that she has moved on from Sasuke.

Apart from that all these third party people are unreliable, Minato: he only knew his son for just a couple of hours Yamato: only just joined the team and jumped the gun, to make it worse for NS he was the most pissed off with the failfession, Sai: only gets his information from a book, Konahamru: only a kid who hardly knows Naruto and lastly Gamakichi: jumped the gun and was proven wrong. all of those characters knew nothing of Naruto and Sakura, yet NS distorts it by saying Naruto's reply is as good as a confession.

I remember this coming from NS

When your fourth hokage father asks if someone is your girlfriend, it must be true, as per Japanese culture

All I said was that Hokage is just a title, the biggest problem with that argument is that Minato has been dead for a whole 16 years, he has only known his son for 2 and a bit hours before he died, so in reality that doesn't count because of Minato's lack of knowledge concerning his son.

NS wasn't please when I said that.

[MichaelInsanity]

HAH. Win mustang. Win. Sorry about that bricksquad. I guess I took that the wrong way. But my point still stands.

[Bubbles]

To be fair to Yamato, NS just assumed he was talking about romance while as usual, ignoring the context of the scenes. The context of that particular scene was on Sakura's desire to be useful and feeling like she isn't. Tell me why would Yamato then talk about romance to her like it has any relevancy to Sakura's feelings of inadquacy in that moment?

Sakura: I can only do the smallest of things for Naruto... *sad*

Now what makes more sense in context?

It's not what you do for him, but how strongly you feel...I can see it just by looking at you...

1. You are in love with Naruto

OR

2. Your feelings for your friend is strong. What matters is the strength of those feelings that even what may seem like the smallest of things mean so very much.

[MichaelInsanity]

Hm. Well that's a good point...
I'm going on chat box. Debatey type stuff and what not is included if you wanna join guys ^_^
https://naruhina.forumotion.com/chatbox/index.forum?

[itachi75]

Private Interview with naruto characters about their feelings. (Itachi ensnared all of them in a genjutsu and forced them to answer all questions honestly)
-
Also if you read it and if you want to call me and idiot go ahead. lol
Part 1. Hinata.

this is a argument and this part 1:

[GreatKungLao]

@lily567



NS: "It doesn't matter if NS is KushiKushi! Kushina still said to find a girl like HER. Not a weirdo like Hinatits."

So now NS is making fun of Hinata because her boobs are huge.......  

Really?

Welcome too the reasoning of shallow reasoning.

You know what actually great about this? Hinata has a perfect body (at least for me), beautiful face, hair and such, but Naruto likes her for her soul and personality! Becuase the beauty that inside is all that matters. Lucky for Naruto is that with such beautiful soul he also gets a girl with appearance of an angel. The fact, that Naruto started love Hinata for her soul, but not body, actually shows how mature he is.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

http://pia-sama.deviantart.com/

[Fallere825]

@lily567



NS: "It doesn't matter if NS is KushiKushi! Kushina still said to find a girl like HER. Not a weirdo like Hinatits."

So now NS is making fun of Hinata because her boobs are huge.......  

Really?

Welcome too the reasoning of shallow reasoning.

You know what actually great about this? Hinata has a perfect body (at least for me), beautiful face, hair and such, but Naruto likes her for her soul and personality! Becuase the beauty that inside is all that matters. Lucky for Naruto is that with such beautiful soul he also gets a girl with appearance of an angel. The fact, that Naruto started love Hinata for her soul, but not body, actually shows how mature he is.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

http://pia-sama.deviantart.com/

^ This right here folks

[Irielo]

we already know how strong hinata feels for naruto but it is naruto's feelings for hinata that we must focus on

This x100.  . Hinata's feelings are fully established. Regardless of what one might ship, distorting the evidence won't bring your pairing any closer to being realized canonically. I see this happen quite often in the shipping community. A NS,NH,SS whatever will distort or over exaggerate the evidence displayed in the manga to suit their agenda. Look at the facts, nothing else.

Looking at the facts led me to observe that love confessions will be made by female characters: Sakura confessing to Sasuke and trying to stop him from leaving Konoha, Hinata confessing to Naruto by intervening against Pein and even Kushina telling her love story with Minato to Naruto. The girls and women in this manga express themselves easier and without ambiguity when it comes to love and romance. I have already written about this in some threads that love in its romance aspect is incarnated by the female characters.

As far as the male characters are concerned,  they do not express themselves through such explicit revelations but rather by their attitude and behaviors. For instance, it's not easy to get Sasuke's feelings because he's someone who would keep these for himself but that does not mean that he can't love. He might express himself only with a light smile and that's how Sasuke is. Naruto is more outgoing when it comes to feelings but again, I don't know if we should expect a confession from him like Sakura or Hinata did. He has already shown since he appeared on the battlefield that he does not ignore Hinata at all and his attitude is giving Hinata the confidence to be with him in the future.

If you have failed to notice it, when Naruto interacts with Hinata, he focuses only on her. In the "It's all in your eyes" moment, he saw how upset Hinata was and he found the right words to motivate her, then when she stood in front of him with Neji and Hiashi to protect him, why did Naruto say only her name, he could have said "you guys?" but he was worried about Hinata only. Then there is the interaction before and during the handhold where nobody dared to interfere even the enemies.

That's why when one takes the 631 girlfriend's joke and thinks that this interaction between Minato, Sakura and Naruto was in a way comparable to the examples I mentioned above, then it fails to see that Sakura and Naruto lack intimacy to be seen as a romantic pairing. If Minato did not ask anything and Naruto had by himself told him "look dad that's my girlfriend", then yes, NS would have a point. But Minato came, he saw Sakura healing Naruto and he just asked that.

In other words when it comes to NaruHina, both characters interact on their own without the intervention of anybody and that's what NS does not have. But if you still consider that NaruHina lacks proper facts to convince you, then it might be because NaruHina does not fit to your taste and not because there are no facts to support it.

[racefan1992]

631 hasn't been brought up, while the hand hold, 615 and Hinata wishing too be by his side have been brought up, would lead anyone too rationally think that it doesn't mean anything anymore.

And if it did? Well Minato basically felt "nostalgic" by seeing and fighting with Naruto, because he IS just like his mother.

Null and viod NS. Null and void.

[bricksquad88]

Regardless of what one might ship, distorting the evidence won't bring your pairing any closer to being realized canonically. I see this happen quite often in the shipping community. A NS,NH,SS whatever will distort or over exaggerate the evidence displayed in the manga to suit their agenda. Look at the facts, nothing else.

Though I don't see how that was distorting evidence, I was just pointing out a song, o_o I agree with you. I've noticed there are pairings who like to cherrypick and ignore the evidence that is already put on the table. This is quite... BOTHERSOME. For example

The hug Sakura gave to Naruto after the pain fight. Ok, now why is this NOT romantic? Simply because of this: Sakura's confession (fake confession). She was willing to ruin her friendship with Naruto, just to keep him from getting hurt. Why do I say this?

Well let's look at some more facts shall we? Sakura was willing to kill Sasuke to prevent him from getting deeper into the darkness, not because she wanted to protect Naruto, though that was a factor, but because she loves Sasuke so much, that she is willing to kill him so he doesn't turn evil.

By killing him, Naruto would never have been the same. Their friendship would have been done for. So you have to understand, she does not love Naruto in any other sense than a good friend. And even then, she is willing to take all of that away.

And that, is my evidence as to why Sakura does NOT love Naruto romantically.

I guess it depends on how you want to interpret it, right? I have many issues with how that "confession" was written. Nevertheless, I agree that Sakura wanted to kill Sasuke to save him from himself; however, I do believe that protecting Naruto was a much greater factor than you might be giving it credit for. Given the context of the whole situation, the reason why Sakura went out to go and "confess" to Naruto and then deal with Sasuke was because of what Sai had said to her. Sai believed that the burden of trying to deal with Sasuke and everyone relying on Naruto too much is what was making him sad. You can even reread chapters 458-459 for context. Sai even said it in these pages (http://mangafox.me/manga/naruto/v49/c458/15.html/ http://mangafox.me/manga/naruto/v49/c458/16.html) "I don't know what you said to him... But it's just like what's been done to me... It feels like a curse. Sasuke causes Naruto pain. But I think you do too". So if anything, what had motivated Sakura to go through with all of this WAS to protect Naruto.

I made no mention of Naruto loving Sakura in my previous point but I understand where you're coming from.

I agree. That's another reason why I have so many issues with how it was written.

To each his/her own. Personally i'm not really sold on any pairing, I'm just waiting to see how things end up. But I will say I'm "more inclined" to NH or ST(even though it's pretty much a crack pairing) then any other.

Sakura also understood, that even if she went to kill Sasuke it would have been a suicide mission, she was most likely going to die because of it, she didn't want Naruto to feel guilty, she knew her fate, to die while killing the one she loves, contrary to NS belief Sakura's feelings for Sasuke have never wavered, they never have and most likely never will. it refuses to see that the biggest reason why NS will not occur is the N and the S.

Naruto: for most likely showing feelings towards Hinata, for accepting the fact that Sakura will always love Sasuke and knowing that he will forever be friendzoned by Sakura. there is little to no evidence to suggest that he was ever in love with Sakure to begin with.

Sakura: She has friendzoned Naruto, there is no evidence to say that she has moved on from Sasuke.

Apart from that all these third party people are unreliable, Minato: he only knew his son for just a couple of hours Yamato: only just joined the team and jumped the gun, to make it worse for NS he was the most pissed off with the failfession, Sai: only gets his information from a book, Konahamru: only a kid who hardly knows Naruto and lastly Gamakichi: jumped the gun and was proven wrong. all of those characters knew nothing of Naruto and Sakura, yet NS distorts it by saying Naruto's reply is as good as a confession.

I remember this coming from NS

When your fourth hokage father asks if someone is your girlfriend, it must be true, as per Japanese culture

All I said was that Hokage is just a title, the biggest problem with that argument is that Minato has been dead for a whole 16 years, he has only known his son for 2 and a bit hours before he died, so in reality that doesn't count because of Minato's lack of knowledge concerning his son.

NS wasn't please when I said that.

I'd have to disagree. It is apparent to anyone who reads the manga that the way Sakura views Sasuke has changed. From Part 1 to now her feelings were initially shallow and then once she had gotten to know Sasuke they developed substance. Throughout Part 2 it is shown that as Sasuke drew further into darkness, Sakura's feelings shifted from hopeful to saddening. I'm not saying that Sakura doesn't have feelings for Sasuke, but I am saying the nature of those feelings has changed significantly since they were first introduced. And it could be inferred that they have wavered since Part 1.

In regards to the people you mentioned: Minato just asked him if that was his girlfriend.. It had no significant affect on the pairings so NS's should not take that as significant evidence, and imo NH's or SS's should not be threatened by 631. Again with Yamato, that has no bearing on the context of the situation. Yamato was never able to finish his thought so I don't really count that as a "significant" or even "miniscule" NS moment tbh.

To be fair to Yamato, NS just assumed he was talking about romance while as usual, ignoring the context of the scenes. The context of that particular scene was on Sakura's desire to be useful and feeling like she isn't. Tell me why would Yamato then talk about romance to her like it has any relevancy to Sakura's feelings of inadquacy in that moment?

Sakura: I can only do the smallest of things for Naruto... *sad*

Now what makes more sense in context?

It's not what you do for him, but how strongly you feel...I can see it just by looking at you...

1. You are in love with Naruto

OR

2. Your feelings for your friend is strong. What matters is the strength of those feelings that even what may seem like the smallest of things mean so very much.

^This x100.

we already know how strong hinata feels for naruto but it is naruto's feelings for hinata that we must focus on

This x100.  . Hinata's feelings are fully established. Regardless of what one might ship, distorting the evidence won't bring your pairing any closer to being realized canonically. I see this happen quite often in the shipping community. A NS,NH,SS whatever will distort or over exaggerate the evidence displayed in the manga to suit their agenda. Look at the facts, nothing else.

Looking at the facts led me to observe that love confessions will be made by female characters: Sakura confessing to Sasuke and trying to stop him from leaving Konoha, Hinata confessing to Naruto by intervening against Pein and even Kushina telling her love story with Minato to Naruto. The girls and women in this manga express themselves easier and without ambiguity when it comes to love and romance. I have already written about this in some threads that love in its romance aspect is incarnated by the female characters.

As far as the male characters are concerned,  they do not express themselves through such explicit revelations but rather by their attitude and behaviors. For instance, it's not easy to get Sasuke's feelings because he's someone who would keep these for himself but that does not mean that he can't love. He might express himself only with a light smile and that's how Sasuke is. Naruto is more outgoing when it comes to feelings but again, I don't know if we should expect a confession from him like Sakura or Hinata did. He has already shown since he appeared on the battlefield that he does not ignore Hinata at all and his attitude is giving Hinata the confidence to be with him in the future.

If you have failed to notice it, when Naruto interacts with Hinata, he focuses only on her. In the "It's all in your eyes" moment, he saw how upset Hinata was and he found the right words to motivate her, then when she stood in front of him with Neji and Hiashi to protect him, why did Naruto say only her name, he could have said "you guys?" but he was worried about Hinata only. Then there is the interaction before and during the handhold where nobody dared to interfere even the enemies.

That's why when one takes the 631 girlfriend's joke and thinks that this interaction between Minato, Sakura and Naruto was in a way comparable to the examples I mentioned above, then it fails to see that Sakura and Naruto lack intimacy to be seen as a romantic pairing. If Minato did not ask anything and Naruto had by himself told him "look dad that's my girlfriend", then yes, NS would have a point. But Minato came, he saw Sakura healing Naruto and he just asked that.

In other words when it comes to NaruHina, both characters interact on their own without the intervention of anybody and that's what NS does not have. But if you still consider that NaruHina lacks proper facts to convince you, then it might be because NaruHina does not fit to your taste and not because there are no facts to support it.

I agree with your points about the women and men in relation to the expressiveness of their feelings.

But to be fair, the majority of Naruto and Hinata's interactions happen in situations where it is usually just the two of them... So I don't know where you're trying to go with this. Well in relation to 615, Neji had just died and Hinata was his cousin and Naruto was his friend, so I think it's pretty appropriate that it was just the two of them. This still doesn't mean that NH is endgame. It's a viable possibility, but not 100% confirmed yet.

Like I said earlier in this post... It was just a question. I don't know why all the shipping community got so riled up because of it. Hasn't changed they dynamics between Naruto and Sakura whatsoever so I don't even think that's relevant tbh.

Lastly, you misread my post. I was speaking in general terms. I wasn't trying to imply that NH doesn't have proper facts... I was just trying to say that the extreme shippers tend to create evidence that isn't there. See, speaking in general terms -_-.

[GreatKungLao]

Minato just asked him if that was his girlfriend..

Minato actually asked Sakura if she is Naruto's girlfriend, where Naruto started answering for her, making fun out of Sakura, as he said in 632. Sakura's Superman head punch is an absolute "NO" to Minato's question.

[Bubbles]

I'd have to disagree. It is apparent to anyone who reads the manga that the way Sakura views Sasuke has changed. From Part 1 to now her feelings were initially shallow and then once she had gotten to know Sasuke they developed substance. Throughout Part 2 it is shown that as Sasuke drew further into darkness, Sakura's feelings shifted from hopeful to saddening. I'm not saying that Sakura doesn't have feelings for Sasuke, but I am saying the nature of those feelings has changed significantly since they were first introduced. And it could be inferred that they have wavered since Part 1.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree with this post. Sakura's feelings for Sasuke have been strong since Part I till now and have not wavered once. Yes, in the beginning of Part I, her feelings for Sasuke were shallow. But as time went on, she did get to know the real him and upon realizing he was entirely human and not perfect, she ended up truly falling in love with him and wanting him to be happy. In Part II, we see both Sakura and Naruto completely  dedicated to bringing Sasuke back and there were no hints of wavering. The only time Sakura showed any  intense sadness toward Sasuke's path was around the 450's when she and Naruto found out that Sasuke had joined the Akatsuki, had attacked Bee and Kage Summit. Before then, she was merely upset that he'd left, but that was Naruto too, to the point where Kakashi called his name "taboo" for their team.

Sakura finding out Sasuke's crimes, right after Pain attack and her mentor's coma took a toll on her. Then Sai coming to her and telling her she is half responsible for Naruto's pain and suffering and that the rookies planned to take out the man she loved pretty much emotionally shattered her. But even when she'd lied to protect Naruto so she can take out Sasuke, she did it because she did not want Naruto to be hurt for one, and two, because she loves Sasuke and she wanted to rescue hiim from the dark path he walked. Not because her feelings had wavered an inch, but because she felt that at that point, the only way she could help him, was to kill him.

Sakura had lost any hope that Sasuke could be saved any other way, this was not her feelings for him wavering. This was her faith in their happy reunion wavering. But by the end of Kage Summit, Naruto had helped restore that faith and by 540, yes she looked gloomy when recalling Sasuke's face, but let's remember she just last saw him at Kage Summit, had no idea where he was or what he was doing (last time she heard, he wanted to destroy Konoha, of course she's sad), but she was sad about the idea that the man she loved was not a great guy liked Love Letter Nin had figured.

The only thing I can say that Sakura felt changed about Sasuke was that he "wasn't the same Sasuke she knew." But he wasn't the same Sasuke anybody knew. Karin felt the same way, his chakra had become darkened. He was in a very dark place, it's not surprising. Of course, by the time Sasuke returned, after a bit of apprehension, she looked pretty much the happiest I can recall seeing her in Part II.

[Irielo]

I agree with your points about the women and men in relation to the expressiveness of their feelings.

But to be fair, the majority of Naruto and Hinata's interactions happen in situations where it is usually just the two of them... So I don't know where you're trying to go with this. Well in relation to 615, Neji had just died and Hinata was his cousin and Naruto was his friend, so I think it's pretty appropriate that it was just the two of them. This still doesn't mean that NH is endgame. It's a viable possibility, but not 100% confirmed yet.

Like I said earlier in this post... It was just a question. I don't know why all the shipping community got so riled up because of it. Hasn't changed they dynamics between Naruto and Sakura whatsoever so I don't even think that's relevant tbh.

Lastly, you misread my post. I was speaking in general terms. I wasn't trying to imply that NH doesn't have proper facts... I was just trying to say that the extreme shippers tend to create evidence that isn't there. See, speaking in general terms -_-.

That's why I stated that there is always an atmosphere of intimacy or privacy when Naruto and Hinata interact which is something necessary to romance whereas NS lacks such moments which could suggest it. In fact NS is like Sai, Yamato and Minato who just assumed things regarding Naruto and Sakura without knowing deeply the characters and making a total abstraction of another important factor: Sasuke. When those characters for instance assumed these things, these assumptions were always destroyed by Naruto and Sakura themselves.

I agree with you on the fact that Neji's death triggered the handhold moment etc. but surprisingly the words used during this moment corresponded exactly to Hinata's resolve in chapter 573: that she would hold Naruto's hand after the war and that she would walk or be by his side. And that actually happened before the end of the war: Naruto hold her hand and thanked her to have always been by his side. If you don't want to see that as a sort of canonization, then, you are free to do so but to deny that it was a major hint would be simply ridiculous imo.

Anyway my friend, I'll give you a +1R because I respect the fact that you dare to reply to so much posts at the same time.

[itachi75]

You what i would love to see. i would love to see NS telling Sakura about her "hidden feelings about NAruto.
-
I would love to see Sakura refute it on every single point lol

[bricksquad88]

Minato just asked him if that was his girlfriend..

Minato actually asked Sakura if she is Naruto's girlfriend, where Naruto started answering for her, making fun out of Sakura, as he said in 632. Sakura's Superman head punch is an absolute "NO" to Minato's question.

Ah yes, you're correct. Fair enough.

I'd have to disagree. It is apparent to anyone who reads the manga that the way Sakura views Sasuke has changed. From Part 1 to now her feelings were initially shallow and then once she had gotten to know Sasuke they developed substance. Throughout Part 2 it is shown that as Sasuke drew further into darkness, Sakura's feelings shifted from hopeful to saddening. I'm not saying that Sakura doesn't have feelings for Sasuke, but I am saying the nature of those feelings has changed significantly since they were first introduced. And it could be inferred that they have wavered since Part 1.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree with this post. Sakura's feelings for Sasuke have been strong since Part I till now and have not wavered once. Yes, in the beginning of Part I, her feelings for Sasuke were shallow. But as time went on, she did get to know the real him and upon realizing he was entirely human and not perfect, she ended up truly falling in love with him and wanting him to be happy. In Part II, we see both Sakura and Naruto completely dedicated to bringing Sasuke back and there were no hints of wavering. The only time Sakura showed any  intense sadness toward Sasuke's path was around the 450's when she and Naruto found out that Sasuke had joined the Akatsuki, had attacked Bee and Kage Summit. Before then, she was merely upset that he'd left, but that was Naruto too, to the point where Kakashi called his name "taboo" for their team.

Sakura finding out Sasuke's crimes, right after Pain attack and her mentor's coma took a toll on her. Then Sai coming to her and telling her she is half responsible for Naruto's pain and suffering and that the rookies planned to take out the man she loved pretty much emotionally shattered her. But even when she'd lied to protect Naruto so she can take out Sasuke, she did it because she did not want Naruto to be hurt for one, and two, because she loves Sasuke and she wanted to rescue hiim from the dark path he walked. Not because her feelings had wavered an inch, but because she felt that at that point, the only way she could help him, was to kill him.

Sakura had lost any hope that Sasuke could be saved any other way, this was not her feelings for him wavering. This was her faith in their happy reunion wavering. But by the end of Kage Summit, Naruto had helped restore that faith and by 540, yes she looked gloomy when recalling Sasuke's face, but let's remember she just last saw him at Kage Summit, had no idea where he was or what he was doing (last time she heard, he wanted to destroy Konoha, of course she's sad), but she was sad about the idea that the man she loved was not a great guy liked Love Letter Nin had figured.

The only thing I can say that Sakura felt changed about Sasuke was that he "wasn't the same Sasuke she knew." But he wasn't the same Sasuke anybody knew. Karin felt the same way, his chakra had become darkened. He was in a very dark place, it's not surprising. Of course, by the time Sasuke returned, after a bit of apprehension, she looked pretty much the happiest I can recall seeing her in Part II.

To the first bolded point: I don't quite agree. I think because of the actions Sasuke has taken, that has played a role in changing the nature of Sakura's feelings towards him, but we'll agree to disagree.

To the second bolded point: Like you had mentioned, she had felt "gloomy" in 540 about Sasuke, yes. Given her facial expression and recent events, I just can't believe that Sakura's "love" for Sasuke hasn't undergone some sort of change. And I believe about 20 chapters ago when Sasuke pulled up, Sai and Sakura were talking and I believe Sai said that because he didn't have a relationship with Sasuke, he could view him more objectively and that he didn't trust him. Sakura's response was iirc I'm glad he's here or something like that. But Sai observed that her smile was "fake", which could be interpreted as her feelings towards Sasuke changing.

I agree with your points about the women and men in relation to the expressiveness of their feelings.

But to be fair, the majority of Naruto and Hinata's interactions happen in situations where it is usually just the two of them... So I don't know where you're trying to go with this. Well in relation to 615, Neji had just died and Hinata was his cousin and Naruto was his friend, so I think it's pretty appropriate that it was just the two of them. This still doesn't mean that NH is endgame. It's a viable possibility, but not 100% confirmed yet.

Like I said earlier in this post... It was just a question. I don't know why all the shipping community got so riled up because of it. Hasn't changed they dynamics between Naruto and Sakura whatsoever so I don't even think that's relevant tbh.

Lastly, you misread my post. I was speaking in general terms. I wasn't trying to imply that NH doesn't have proper facts... I was just trying to say that the extreme shippers tend to create evidence that isn't there. See, speaking in general terms -_-.

That's why I stated that there is always an atmosphere of intimacy or privacy when Naruto and Hinata interact which is something necessary to romance whereas NS lacks such moments which could suggest it. In fact NS is like Sai, Yamato and Minato who just assumed things regarding Naruto and Sakura without knowing deeply the characters and making a total abstraction of another important factor: Sasuke. When those characters for instance assumed these things, these assumptions were always destroyed by Naruto and Sakura themselves.

I agree with you on the fact that Neji's death triggered the handhold moment etc. but surprisingly the words used during this moment corresponded exactly to Hinata's resolve in chapter 573: that she would hold Naruto's hand after the war and that she would walk or be by his side. And that actually happened before the end of the war: Naruto hold her hand and thanked her to have always been by his side. If you don't want to see that as a sort of canonization, then, you are free to do so but to deny that it was a major hint would be simply ridiculous imo.

Anyway my friend, I'll give you a +1R because I respect the fact that you dare to reply to so much posts at the same time.

Fair enough. I agree with most of what is said here. NS's do tend to exclude Sasuke as a variable in these shipping equations. Now regarding 615 as some form of canonization, I believe that moment potentially changed things between Naruto and Hinata, and I never said that it wasn't a *major hint*, but I'm just going to wait and see how things turn out.
Props on the +1R ;)

[Bubbles]

To the second bolded point: Like you had mentioned, she had felt "gloomy" in 540 about Sasuke, yes. Given her facial expression and recent events, I just can't believe that Sakura's "love" for Sasuke hasn't undergone some sort of change. And I believe about 20 chapters ago when Sasuke pulled up, Sai and Sakura were talking and I believe Sai said that because he didn't have a relationship with Sasuke, he could view him more objectively and that he didn't trust him. Sakura's response was iirc I'm glad he's here or something like that. But Sai observed that her smile was "fake", which could be interpreted as her feelings towards Sasuke changing.

Yes, I've heard this viewpoint before. Sai said the smile was false, but her words may be true. And as I'd responded before, while it could mean that her feelings toward Sasuke are "changing" it could also mean that while Sakura is telling the truth about being glad he is back and trusting that he is on their side as he says, that she also does not know all the facts.

Like, what 'all these things' ("a lot of things happened"-Sasuke) that Sasuke mentioned to get him to their side in the first place even are, and she is worried that perhaps he might leave them again, or even that whatever got him on their side might ultimately conflict with them. But she had a false smile on to try and pretend to Sai that she wasn't worried about anything.

Though personally, even if the former turns to be true (her not trusting him)I do not see why Sakura possibly not having this full trust in Sasuke just because he came back all of a sudden means her feelings for him are thus likely changing. Is it now not possible to love someone and still be wary of their intentions? The last time they met up, he was planning to destroy Konoha, and lets not forget kishi has intentionally kept Sakura in the dark about Sasuke, so she is the only one in original Team 7, who has no idea why Sasuke did what he had. From her point of view, he just went off the deep end for no reason and now he is back. Being wary isn't such a farfetched thing to be in this situation.

[lily567]

honestly I don't believe sakura's feelings for sasuke are changing. yes she doesn't know what naruto knows but I think that she is just sad that he is not the sasuke she knew when they were children. everyone else doesn't know about sasuke either but once they find out the truth , I think everyone including sakura can understand and she will want to help him even more than she did when they were kids imo.

[GreatKungLao]

I love this genius anti-parallels collage:

Spoiler:

http://antinarusucku.deviantart.com/

[Bubbles]

I love this genius anti-parallels collage:

Spoiler:

http://antinarusucku.deviantart.com/

xD I've seen this one before.
But watch NS then say: "That's his mother! Sakura is basically his girlfriend his teammate and the girl he loves, it's completely different love!" Which is true, but NS would of course ignore the point that Naruto is aware of who is lying and who isn't.

[GreatKungLao]

I love this genius anti-parallels collage:

Spoiler:

http://antinarusucku.deviantart.com/

xD I've seen this one before.
But watch NS then say: "That's his mother! Sakura is basically his girlfriend his teammate and the girl he loves, it's completely different love!" Which is true, but NS would of course ignore the point that Naruto is aware of who is lying and who isn't.

Exactly.

This DA account has EVERYTHING you would ever needed, that destroys all what NS was trying to come up with. This one is especially good:

Spoiler:

[Mustang]

I love this genius anti-parallels collage:

Spoiler:

http://antinarusucku.deviantart.com/

xD I've seen this one before.
But watch NS then say: "That's his mother! Sakura is basically his girlfriend his teammate and the girl he loves, it's completely different love!" Which is true, but NS would of course ignore the point that Naruto is aware of who is lying and who isn't.

Exactly.

This DA account has EVERYTHING you would ever needed, that destroys all what NS was trying to come up with. This one is especially good:

Spoiler:

opps now lets try that again instead of accidently editing someones post.

Would love to see NS counter NH when it becomes canon, I mean we aren't too far off from that special moment.

[itachi75]

All NH just insults and belittles Sakura, just like Hinata is jealous of Sakura. Hinata should just give up and leave Naruto and Sakura alone, they love eachother as of 631, so she should go away.

ay yi yi, how many of you even insult Sakura? or think HInata is jealous of Sakura? and of course 631 doesn't cannolize 631. I didn't even reply to NS.

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